To subscribe to this RSS feed, copy and paste this URL into your RSS reader. is that because water doesn't really hit that area?" - Lisa Jasper That's pushing it but should be fine. Cement board is the most common and widely-known backer board. I set the Kerdi with my hands, pat it into the thinset with my hands, then go over it with a 4" taping knife held at a low angle to embed the Kerdi in the thinset. ".1) is is okay to use kerdi board instead of ditra on the floor? It costs more but it;s worth it for the ease of install IMO. Schulter Ditra is manufactured by Schluter Systems and is a 1/8 thick polyethylene uncoupling membrane that is specifically designed for tile installations. While cement board may be the most common and widely-known tile substrate, Kerdi Board is giving it a run for its money. We also found that using a heavy rolling pin worked wonders for really setting the Kerdi. After roughly two days I would fill the corner with silicone. Additionally, the use of modified thinset with KERDI could lead to cracks and other issues down the line as the modified thinset can shrink and pull away from the KERDI membrane over time. Cement board is a bit better, but you need to spray either one before applying the mortar so that it doesn't "skin over" before you can get the Kerdi up. I imagine we could share some good stories. For indoor projects and gypsum board, thinset with a latex acrylic modifier is ideal. After today's tutorial, you'll gain the confidence to transform your old bathroom into a new space. When installed, Kerdi Board creates a substrate that is level, flat, square, plumb, and dimensionally stable. I used to "trust" the Kerdi and drywall until I had a shower that the valve broke inside the wall cavity four years after being put in. 3. Because it can let some moisture wick through it, you have two choices: put a moisture barrier behind it to protect the structure, or, waterproof the front of it. Is it plausible for constructed languages to be used to affect thought and control or mold people towards desired outcomes? This will prevent water from entering from behind the membrane, and will provide a more secure waterproof layer. One of the major benefits of opting for Kerdi Board over cement board is the ease of installation. There's a really great manual (with diagrams) that makes this all easier to understand. Yes, you should prime drywall before installing KERDI in order to ensure proper adhesion and a successful installation. . My floor tiles are 2" x 2"." - Lisa Jasper No - you can not use Kerdi Board on the floor. What's the difference between a power rail and a signal line? document.getElementById("ak_js_1").setAttribute("value",(new Date()).getTime()); Your email address will not be published. What Is the Difference Between 'Man' And 'Son of Man' in Num 23:19? Seams and joints should also be waterproofed and caulked to prevent water from seeping through. Houzz Pro: One simple solution for contractors and design pros, surfer thanked Avanti Tile & Stone / Stonetech. Step 7: Cut the Tile. link to How To Organize A Bathroom Closet. I usually use Durock. I would get someone else. And for a more secure fit, you can also use screws. But I did want to understand the cost breakdown as the walls then become WAY more expensive than it would be with Redguard. Slap it up comb it out, leave every ridge tall and perfect. x 96 in. The most important thing to remember when applying the membrane over the cement board is to make sure the surface is clean and free of any debris, dust or other contaminants. Their lighter weight makes moving panels around during installation a cinch, which is a far cry from the heft of conventional cement board. x 48 in. These multifunctional tile substrate and building panels are thus perfect for creating bonded waterproofing assemblies with tile coverings. Problem with very thick cement board/ tile/bullnose edge, Steam Shower Slip Joint Detail - The secret is in the boarding stage. If youre not careful, the boards can also leave behind abrasive sandy crumbs that can cause damage to your shower base or tub. Why are physically impossible and logically impossible concepts considered separate in terms of probability? The back side of the drywall fails and it is just as bad or worse than if it had an issue on the tile side. Wedi showers feature a pre-sloped base that is already installed. How did this project turn out? This will ensure a strong bond between the KERDI membrane and the substrate. This product is available in 3/16", 3/8", 1/2", 5/8" 3/4", 1" 1-1/2" and 2" thicknesses, allowing for a wide variety of installation options. I appreciate your help and your quick response. Properly waterproofed Hardie board should last for many years. After priming, use an approved adhesive to adhere the KERDI membrane to the drywall, making sure the edges are well sealed and joints are tight.if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[468,60],'remodelormove_com-medrectangle-4','ezslot_12',156,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-remodelormove_com-medrectangle-4-0'); A successful installation of KERDI requires well-prepared surfaces and a proper application, so take the time to properly prime the drywall before installation. We store towels, medicine, toiletry supplies, first-aid gear, massage devices, facial steamers, spare Painting your garage is a great way to improve the look of the space and make the walls easier to clean. I trust it and have never had a callback. When having to put it up on the wall or measure it for size, you will find that you can get the exact measurements you need without much trouble. Kerdi can even be installed over drywall. The Kerdi membrane should be applied with the standard procedure, using a hogg brush or a notched trowel to spread the thin-set mortar and a roller to ensure appropriate adhesion. Why does the plumbing rough need to be moved? When it comes to selecting thinset for cement board, there are a few important factors to consider. Yes, Schluter membranes can go over cement board. Do you have any pictures? Can be cut to size easily using a utility knife. Depending on your project and the specific cement board you are using, you will want to select a thinset appropriate for both.if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[468,60],'remodelormove_com-large-leaderboard-2','ezslot_15',158,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-remodelormove_com-large-leaderboard-2-0'); The two primary criteria to help guide your selection are the type of cement board you are using and whether you are installing it indoors or outdoors. Water-resistant gypsum board, or green board, was used in the past as a tile backer but is no longer recommended, mainly because better products are available. #3 This is a DIY site. 173 upvotes. This means that even if your waterproofing system leaks, the cement board will remain intact. That's the way us "Tile Guys" do it all the time. Once its cleaned, use caulk to seal all of the seams where the cement board meets the walls. Kerdi-Board panels allow the installer to prepare and create a broad range . The difference between the phonemes /p/ and /b/ in Japanese. Allow the primer to dry completely before proceeding with the KERDI installation. In a perfect job, it will waterproof. By the time you switch from the RG application to the Kerdi installation, it should be dry. And by 'booking the Kerdi' I mean we put it in the bathtub, sprayed it with the handshower, then booked it (just like wallpaper). Anytime Mongo. The drywall's back side fails, and it's just as bad or worse than it was on the tile side. Ceramic Tile Advice Forums - John Bridge Ceramic Tile, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G4HjHT6_cUo, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wEt6irjJCI0, My master suite addition & full bath to 1/2 bath renovation. Cement board is readily available and relatively inexpensive (about $10 for a 3 x 5-ft. sheet). As such, many homeowners and professionals find themselves wondering whether Kerdi Board or cement board is the better tile substrate. Welcome to the site. A quality underlayment will also serve as a waterproof barrier between the subfloor and the tile surface. Installing cement board involves placing the boards atop a layer of thinset adhesive, a process known as bedding. Not everyone knows how to do mud and lathe it's so old school plus it wears you out, ive been a setter for 27 yrs and I have yet to go back to one of my showers I installed using perma base or durock, with a liner, i have started using waterproofing such as redguard or aqua-defense. The surface of Wedi is perfect for bonding. That was not a fault of the Kerdi, or the installation. How "tidy" does the kerdi band need to be? True cement board (Durck, Wonderboard) is my first choice as a tile or Kerdi backer. I still wet the walls first. We tried adding water to the thinset, we tried . My idea is to block in and install the tub in the existing corner, erect the new wet wall, and use hardi-backer to shim the wall out over the tub flange, then apply kerdi over the whole thing.Does kerdi take offense at being installed over hardi? RedGard On Hardibacker Board. Allow the adhesive to cure for the amount of time recommended by the adhesives manufacturer. This is a bit difficult to answer as it depends on the particular application for the floor system. Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers. When applying thin-set mortar, the manufacturers instructions should be followed closely. Foam-core tile backing board has two big advantages over other backer boards. Everyone knows brick and stucco, but what about fiber cement and metal? rev2023.3.3.43278. I want to mount a cast iron bathtub, but not pull down my 1905 plaster and lath. By clicking Post Your Answer, you agree to our terms of service, privacy policy and cookie policy. My understanding is that Schluter-Kerdi, being a sheet topical membrane, recommends just going with regular drywall instead of cement board but you can certainly use cement board as the substrate. Will be replacing tub shower combination with tiled shower in my home. Bathroom closets are often catch-alls for anything and everything remotely related to self-care. A successful tile installation largely depends on the substrate that the tile is attached to. Since the existing wall board will be removed, I'd prefer to go a little extra and install a water proof cement board type base so the tile has a solid substrate even if it were to get wet, such as from a plumbing leak, or from infiltration on an exterior wall (as unlikely as that might be). Sloped Shower Tray KST1220/1525 - The Home Depot. Some being easier to work with than others. If there is no blocking behind the seam, i would just tape prior to installing the membrane, the thinset will fill the seam and embed the mesh. What changes do you suggest to make Bathroom looks more updated? #4 You could be adding a good 1000 pounds to your install too. However, you do still have to take care to waterproof the seams and the fastener penetrations to create a waterproof assembly. Creative, C'mon over for a beer! Additionally, it is important to waterproof cement board before tiling, as the grout and tiles can help keep the board watertight. How should I transition between cement board floor and alcove tub? An extra layer of thinset is then added to the surface of the cement board to adhere the tiles in place. Kerdi board is a kind of waterproofer because these kinds of boards are made of XPS foam. When installing Schluter Kerdi Membrane over cement backerboard: Should I use Alkali Resistant Mesh Tape and thinset on the seams of the backer board (for long term durability to prevent each board moving independently thus preventing cracking) prior to installing the Kerdi membrane. If you want added info there's an old Kerdi thread here. Do new devs get fired if they can't solve a certain bug? If you want to go to the extra effort of putting the membrane over drywall, there is no need to use greenboard. x 33 ft. Waterproofing Membrane: Kerdi-Board 1/2 in. No bulges either, but definetly no thin spots.-Not paying attention to the direction of the comb. I guess I could save a few $ and laminate 1/4" drywall there instead.IOW, is hardi OK to level out the tub flange?Not that it matters, but the tile will be 3x6 carrara to the ceiling.Casey. Kerdi Board is also significantly lighter in terms of weight than cement board, meaning they can be transported and lifted into place with ease evening hauling five panels at a time should be no problem. Step 3: Apply Thinset. Kerdi Board vs. Cement Board. To create a watertight shower assembly, we installed Schluter's Kerdi membrane over the drywall, just as we would for tile.Write by:. A mortar wall is better and can be customized easier. 120 sq feet including the floor. More waste, yes, but I think you have to have a LOT of practice to hang those huge sheets like mongo does. Kerdi can be installed first on drywall or cement board. This will help protect the cement board from water damage, and is often a specific type of coating designed for use with cement boards. . Kerdi is also used as shower lining, as required in IRC Section P2709.2 and IPC Section 417.5.2, over concrete, mortar, tile backerboard, expanded polystyrene foam board, prefabricated polystyrene shower trays, curb and ramp, gypsum board and masonry substrates." So, you can choose what board you want in your shower when using Kerdi. Additionally, the drywall should be primed with a latex primer before applying the Kerdi membrane. Step 2: Determine the room's center. We are no longer supporting IE (Internet Explorer), Do not Sell or Share My Personal Information. I'm thirsty. FRC board tends to be more moisture-resistant than gypsum board and is best suited for outdoor projects such as showers or tub surrounds. Fiber cement board is available in 1/4-inch and 1/2-inch thicknesses. To get the most protection from the cement board, it should be installed in a way that ensures it is waterproof, in addition to being secured properly with the right adhesive and screws. Once you have selected the right sealer, follow the manufacturers instructions and apply a generous, even coat over the entire surface of the Hardie board. Too little, and the kerdi will never show you gray, no matter how you sweat. Any recommendations? The use of modified thinset adhesive could result in an inadequate bond and could lead to possible delamination. Why is there a voltage on my HDMI and coaxial cables? Thanks. They are square. Je peux rejeter les cookies non essentiels en cliquant sur Grer mes prfrences . Once all areas have been properly waterproofed, the walls can be tiled and grouted to create a waterproof surface. By clicking Accept all cookies, you agree Stack Exchange can store cookies on your device and disclose information in accordance with our Cookie Policy. If any is found, wait a few more hours and then re-inspect. The core isnt waterproof, but it can withstand getting wet without falling apart, so even if your waterproofing system leaks, the board will stay intact. We want that inside corner able to move. While cement board and grout are not waterproof, Kerdi is and can even be directly installed over drywall. Will use the Schluter Shower system. 4. KERDI was developed as a waterproofing membrane to be used in . Installation; As the GoBoard is very lightweight, it becomes easy to . It looks like Kerdi membrane is ~$2/sqft ($200 for a 108sqft roll) and kerdi board is $3.7/sqft ($115 for a 4x8 sheet (Lowes)). What is a word for the arcane equivalent of a monastery? The product involves an extruded polystyrene foam panel, with specialized reinforcement materials on both sides. The main types of cement board you could encounter are Fibre Reinforced Cement (FRC) board and gypsum board. First, you would waterproof with your favorite liquid waterproofing membrane of . Here's how to get it right the first time, If you've got a steady hand, a few easy-to-find supplies and patience, you can install a tile backsplash in a kitchen or bathroom, Step 4 in swapping your tub for a sleek new shower: Pick your waterproofing materials and drain, and don't forget to test, Work with your contractors and installers to ensure a safe, stylish curb that keeps the water where it belongs, Get the benefits of a time-honored ritual without firing up the coals, thanks to easier-than-ever home steam systems, Landscape Architects & Landscape Designers, Outdoor Lighting & Audio/Visual Specialists, Out With the Old Tile: 8 Steps to Prep for Demolition, Convert Your Tub Space Into a Shower Waterproofing and Drainage, Steam Showers Bring a Beloved Spa Feature Home. if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[580,400],'remodelormove_com-large-mobile-banner-1','ezslot_17',164,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-remodelormove_com-large-mobile-banner-1-0');As an added precaution, you may want to consider to adding a water-resistant layer afterwards, such as a caulking or flashing tape. I think the first one I used was cheap and that was part of the problem. Regardless, cement board is a great, trusted tile substrate that will work well on both walls and floors. Install the drain adapter, if needed. Schluter Kerdi-Shower-T/-TS/-TT 48 in. We are DIYers who have already remodeled one bathroom successfully, but this is our first time using The Schluter shower system. Do I have to use Kerdi tape with Ditra membrane? Continuing Education for Architects & Designers. To put things into perspective, consider that a tile floor is made up of three layers: the subfloor, the underlayment, and the tile surface you walk on. On the other hand, a Schlter system offers improved thermal insulation, which can help to reduce heating costs. You are wise to use a cement board. A.Sean Gerolimatos, technical services manager for Schluter Systems, responds: With a few exceptions, unmodified thinset mortar is required for setting ceramic and stone tile over Kerdi membranes (800/472-4588, www.schluter.com ), as well as for bonding overlapped seams and connections to Kerdi drains. Additionally, you can use KERDI-BAND around corners, seams, and joints to help with a waterproof installation. (3ft-3in wide). I like to use a garden sprayer to keep the thirsty Kerdi wet. Such membranes typically come in a brush or a roller form and can help create a durable barrier against water infiltration. Also, apply the acrylic mastic between the Create curved designs around pipes or columns using the vertically-grooved KERDI-BOARD-V, or use L-shaped KERDI-BOARD-E panels to enclose similar. Send us an email: , What type of thin-set mortar should I use when installing Schluter, Using a Prefabricated Shower Tray and Ramp. En cliquant sur Accepter , j'accepte l'utilisation des cookies telle qu'elle est dcrite plus en dtail dans la Politique d'Utilisation des Cookies de Houzz. Will add it in. Anyone who has done more than 1 shower shouldn't start without knowing that. The manual can be found here: http://floorelf.com/waterproof, I would say unless you are experienced in working with Schluter-Kerdi waterproofing membrane kit, then I would say work with an easier waterproofing approach, either liquid waterproofing or a combination of liquid and traditional waterproofing (plastic covering the wood frame). MAPEI makes products for each step of the remodel process, giving you a single source solution, and only one phone number to call if you need assistance! If you can avoid that, the demo would be ~easy enough to maybe have some friends who'd work for beer come over and help you knock it out. Here are the fundamentals of tile installation over cement board. Blocking should be constant across this area when openings are larger than your fist. When screwed to the framing, thin strips of cement board fracture more easily than thin strips of fiber-cement. In order to determine which tile underlayment is right for your project, you need to know which issue youre trying to solve whether its preventing subfloor cracks from transferring to the tile, soundproofing, moisture protection, or providing more rigidity to the tile. Hang the cement boar. I simply sponge off the excess. When screwed to the framing, thin strips of cement board fracture more easily than thin strips of fiber-cement. A good rule of thumb is 24 hours per inch of thickness, then one more day on top of that to be sure. To prevent those movements from transferring to the tile floor, consider installing an uncoupling membrane between the concrete and tile surfaces. Thanks to all for the feedback. While cement board is a reliable tile underlayment, it isnt completely waterproof only water-resistant. builder, anti-builder, rebuilder -- Retired Moderator. The big issue with cement board is that the thinset will skin over really quickly. :/. For the floor I make a dry mix mud base and then the Kerdi membrane. ", Signed,Never Hung Kerdi A Day In Her Life. Plus, if you use the mold and moisture resistant drywall, it will be extra insurance against mold. Keep in mind that most tile setters err on the side of caution and brush a waterproofing membrane on top of cement board when it is in wet areas like showers or tub surrounds. One of the major benefits of opting for Kerdi Board over cement board is the ease of installation. It is important to seal any imperfections in the drywall to ensure a long-lasting installation and to minimize water infiltration. What can a lawyer do if the client wants him to be acquitted of everything despite serious evidence? Its important to note that Kerdi membrane is not a structural base layer, so plywood should be installed and reinforced as necessary based on load requirements. Thanks for contributing an answer to Home Improvement Stack Exchange! This makes Kerdi Board suitable for a wide variety of interior applications, including kitchen countertops. Kerdi membrane prevents water damage and mold development. ! Additionally, if the cement board isnt waterproof, it can also cause mold and mildew issues, as well as dry wall damage from the moisture seeping through. Dean, our tile consultant, says glass mat backer board is his first choice due to the ease of installation, cost, and because his workers like it. Euler: A baby on his lap, a cat on his back thats how he wrote his immortal works (origin? Ditra is a 1/8-inch thick polyethylene membrane with a layer of anchoring fleece on the underside and a grid of square cavities on top. Why is this the case? With Kerdi Board you get to enjoy an effective product that is lightweight, easy to cut, waterproof, and leaves behind no dust! Project Type: Tile / Category: Bathroom. This creates a strong, waterproof tile backer that also functions as an uncoupling membrane. However if installed on drywall it is only protecting one side. Our thinset was more watery than the videos, but it still managed to dry out quickly, even in the time it takes to apply the small corners in our shampoo niche. link to What Kind Of Paint For Garage Walls? The curb doesn't have to be any wider than a 2x4. I hang Kerdi on cement board and fibercement board all the time. Once all that is completed and the Aquadefense has dried, you can install your tile with a polymer modified mortar meeting the ANSI requirements of A118.4 or A118.11. Browse other questions tagged, Start here for a quick overview of the site, Detailed answers to any questions you might have, Discuss the workings and policies of this site. It is lightweight and made of expanded polystyrene. Install the Schluter Kerdi membrane over the backer board using the correct mortar. This will include installing its components, such as drain plate and drain collar, as well as Kerdi Band for further protection of seams and corners. Additionally, all thin-set mortars should be suitable for use in wet or feature depths of up to 1/8 inch. Cement board is the industry standard when it comes to tile substrates and the most preferred among professionals when installing porcelain or ceramic tile. With so many different types of underlayment to choose from, it can be hard to decide which is best for your project.
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